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Post by beaudro on Mar 7, 2008 16:30:56 GMT -5
I havn't made any in a while, thought they were cool and made these at first. I got interested in how they were made originally.
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Post by caretaker on Mar 7, 2008 16:53:46 GMT -5
Beautiful pipes. Got my intrest. Yep, gonna have ta try that.
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Post by beaudro on Mar 7, 2008 17:03:49 GMT -5
I might warn you, just for anyone that doesn't know, but the dust off this stuff is bad for you. Catlinite, soapstone, alabaster, or just about any of them contain silicates, it's some pretty bad stuff for the lungs, not much different that asbestos. I try not to use power tools, just use a file and wet sand paper. You should wear a mask, and for the most part I do. It's easy stuff to carve on, all you need is a file and a hacksaw for cutting the stuff out. When you get down to making a stem, you'll be amazed at how the natives did it. It took me alot of research to figure it out. Had to think a while on how they got a small hole through a 2 foot peice of wood.
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Post by fishinmusician on Mar 13, 2008 12:01:00 GMT -5
beaudro, Enjoy your pipes and have been thinking about making one out of deer antler. Still am curious about how to get that small hole though a 2ft piece of would? Can you share this info or tell me where to look? Thanks! Dave
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Post by joanne on Mar 13, 2008 12:31:31 GMT -5
Hi Dave. :-) Allen-Those pipes are beautiful. Are those muskrat furs below them? I just finally braintanned one not too long ago and it was tricky! but came out fine..soft. and complete. this was a fox skull alongside the muskrat. anyway.. nice pipes Allen.. I was thinking that that dust has to be pretty dangerous to your lungs.. as well as the antler bone dust.. I will soon be into that.. hmm, where are those masks anyway!
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Post by longtrail on Mar 14, 2008 0:48:30 GMT -5
Nice pipes, do you live somewhere close to where pipestone is found? so how did you/ they get thehole through the wood? Burn it? Ok, P, give it up, spill the beans, lay it on the line, how many people do you have working for you? hahahahahahahahahahahah
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Post by beaudro on Mar 14, 2008 18:45:01 GMT -5
I got so busy these last few days I havn't had time to get on here, I've missed it, hope I can catch up with whats going on. I had a really interesting time doing some research on pipes, First I seen one in Gilcrease Museum in Tulsa, it was so near perfect that I couldn't believe it. The were all perfectly round, most of them carved beautifully, and many had lead or pewter inlays. I was so surprised that I honestly doubted the credibility of the museum, I thought it was fake. Gilcrease is a really special museum, and with a great staff. I took the opportunity and ask the head archaeologist about the peace pipes, she assured me the pipes were original, but she had no real details of how they were made. I don't know why I got so stubborn, so I did some research. I found out most of the elaborate pipes are Sioux , the plains indian. Most pipes, but not all of course, are made of Catlinite, which comes from the famous pipe stone quarry in minnesota,, but catlinite can be found in other places as well, Utah is another good one. I went on Ebay and found some, duh, i'm not the only pipe maker. I bought some and found it rather easy to work with, you can saw it with a hacksaw, file it with a rasp, I even put it in my vise to work it. It's the perfect stuff for pipes, and I havn't broke one yet,, but I know it's going to happen. I can drill it with any ole wood bit, So the calumet pipe bowl isn't hard to work with,, if your half good with your hands,, i'm 1/4 good. After building my first bowl, i thought it was down hill, but i ran into the snag on making a long stem, and doing it authentically. Most pipe stems are elaborate, the Sioux, again, had some of the most brilliant ways of making them. They would cut slits lengthwise down the stem, which allows air to circulate around the wood and cool the smoke, the length is also a cooling effect, some decorations did the same by absorbing heat, like a heat sink. But all in all, i wondered why the choice of wood, which is mainly Sumac. The originals I had seen in the oldest category, before the Reservation Period, were all Sumac. So... I found Oklahoma sumac, close enough for me to work with, and I started carving it all down with a draw knife, rasps, files, and now I have to figure out the hole.... and a drill bit just doesn't work, it's virtually impossible, unless your really lucky , to try and drill a 24 inch hole throught a piece and make it come out on the other side where you want it to.. and i'm suppose to be figureing out how an Indian did this. It will not burn either, even through trade some tribes acquired copper wire, but if you heat it, try to burn through a piece of wood it will take the path of least resistance and go anywhere but the other end. Long story,, i know,,, I tried drilling about 6 pieces, none worked, so I ran out of the good sumac I was trying to use and went to the wood pile for another, but i all i had was pieces of limbs that were about 1 year old. It was ok, i'm gonna do this anyway, I cut it to length and noticed the PITH, or the core/center of the limb. It's real soft, softer than balsa wood, and most of it will fall out on it's own... So.... I just held it up to my mouth, started blowing on it, and after a few times I had a hole all the way through the limb, about 1/8 inch diameter, perfectly through the stem,, now take that and carve it and your done.. my conclusion to this horrid story.,, no drill, no red hot wire,, just common knowledge of what nature has laying around , it was so simple I took it to that same archaelogist and she wrote an article on it. Not as if I'm the only one to figure this out,, there are places that sell Sumac already cured and ready to use, and there are many good pipe builders out there that are making amazing looking peace pipes, I still love making them, but I havn't made any in a long time. The fun was in figureing it out I guess. I think i have the links to websites that will show you more on it, if anyone wants to build one the tricks I learned are pretty handy maybe.
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Post by joanne on Mar 14, 2008 22:54:08 GMT -5
Well Allen. I don't know doodly about catlinite pipes. So now I know a little more.. what I do know something about is passion and daing.. reading your long post about the catlinite pipes was good stuff. thx.. Sure glad you made your way over here cause it's posts like these that make a forum very interesting. Pouring out your heart over these sweet bowls.. just awesome!
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Post by livesalone on Mar 15, 2008 0:08:20 GMT -5
beaudro, Thanks for sharing! I knew about the pith in the sumac (can use them for straws) but I didn't know that was what they used for the stems of pipes! I am getting some catlinite for making myself a pipe this summer and I sure would like the link to buy the sumac...it doesn't grow here.. Thanks! Lynne
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Post by caretaker on Mar 15, 2008 7:03:23 GMT -5
thanks for the info. I still want to try my hand at making a pipe or two.
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Post by beaudro on Mar 15, 2008 8:10:14 GMT -5
www.thepipemaker.com , longtrail heres that link, they have just about anything for pipes i think. You can use other wood , doesn't have to be sumac,, It may or may not do as well for the pith BUT as long as that pith is almost gone you can drill it or burn it through , it just needs to be soft enough to give you a pilot hole.
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Post by fishinmusician on Mar 17, 2008 11:03:59 GMT -5
Thanks Beaudro! I'll start looking at the different trees we have around here and see if any will work. Just want to make one for myself and half the fun is figuring out how! Thanks! Dave
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Post by beaudro on Mar 17, 2008 12:38:33 GMT -5
It was fun, and if your hard headed like i was you'll come out with a good one or more. It's always a conversation piece around the fire.
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Post by caretaker on Jun 6, 2008 8:13:33 GMT -5
Got a piece of hollowed out cured wood ready fer a stem. Gonna work on a bowl. Then try to put it all together. Wish me luck. I `m sure I`lll screw it up some how. Takin my time been workin on the piece of wood for 3 months. beaudro, you put a challange on me and I know my first won`t be as good as yours but I hope I`ll get better wiff time. Question? will it hurt to put linseed oil on the stem to color/cure it?
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Post by beaudro on Jun 6, 2008 8:38:26 GMT -5
Caretaker, thanks for the kind words, but I bet you can carve a stem alot better than mine. I don't think i ever put many hours into it. My quest on the pipe making thing was mainly trying to figure out how the natives got the hole in the stem. That is where most of my effort was anyway. As far as linseed oil, personally i would use it, as I do on almost everything. I have used boiled linseed oil many times, but i prefer raw linseed oil. Bear fat/oil , tallow, lard, suet, beaver grease, anything that keeps moisture out of the wood looks like is a good thing to me. post a few pics of your progress and maybe you'll inspire me to get up and work on one , it's been awhile.
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